382: Macros Without Obsession: Volume Eating Hacks from Lillie Eats and Tells

Introduction 

You're listening to Biceps After Babies Radio Episode 382.

Hello and welcome to Biceps After Babies Radio. A podcast for ladies who know that fitness is about so much more than pounds lost or PR's. It's about feeling confident in your skin and empowered in your life. I'm your host Amber Brueseke, a registered nurse, personal trainer, wife and mom of four. Each week my guests and I will excite and motivate you to take action in your own personal fitness as we talk about nutrition, exercise, mindset, personal development and executing life with conscious intention. If your goal is to look, feel and be strong and experience transformation from the inside out, you my friend are in the right place. Thank you for tuning in. Now, let's jump into today's episode.

Hey, hey, hey, welcome back to another episode of Biceps After Babies Radio, I'm your host, Amber Brueseke, and sometimes the most life-changing journeys start with unexpected problems. For my guest today, Lillie Biesinger, you may also know her as Lillie Eats and Tells, it was a gallbladder issue right before a dream trip to Italy that led her to discovering macro-counting, and then eventually building a business helping thousands and thousands of women eat beautifully aesthetic food while hitting their goals. But here's what's fascinating. Lillie's approach was different from day one. While everybody else in the industry and the space was making protein pop-tarts and trying to healthify junk food, Lillie came on creating gorgeous veggie-packed meals that actually looked like food that you'd want to eat. So today on the podcast, we're talking about how macro-tracking doesn't have to be restrictive, how to make meals that both satisfy your macros and your taste buds, and why the same approach that, you know, worked at 30 might not work at age 40 or beyond. So if you've ever felt like macro-friendly food looks boring, or you've wondered how to make this sustainable long-term, this episode is for you. All right, let's dive into that interview with Lillie Eats and Tells. 

Amber B 02:06

I am so excited to welcome back to the podcast, Lillie Biesinger. Lillie, it's been a hot second since you've been on the podcast. You were- 

Lillie Biesinger 02:16

I know. 

Amber B 02:16

Way, way, way, way, way back. I was just talking about how I started the podcast in 2018, and you were on way back in 2018. 

Lillie Biesinger 02:23

I was going to ask, is that when it was? Okay, it has been a long time.

Amber B 02:25

It's been a long time. So I'm really excited to kind of do a little bit of an update. And before we hit record, I was just kind of talking about how when you've been in the industry as long as you and I have, you've learned a lot of things, and you've tried a lot of things, and you've changed your mind on things. And those are some of the things that I want to talk about in today's episode. But before we do that, let's go back to like the very beginning of like your origin story. Back when you first found macro counting, what was that journey like? What was going on in your life way back then? And what was your relationship with food like, and what drew you into macro counting? 

Lillie Biesinger 03:01

So I remember it so vividly, and it is funny because it's you, and you were the start of it for me. It's just so funny. It's been so long. But I mean, it was 2018. So my kids were, well, whatever. They were little. I was definitely like had little kids. And I remember, so I had a friend who moved away to Orange County. I was living out in the desert. And she started counting macros. And it was one of those things like Instagram was new. It was nothing. I didn't know what it was at all, right? I just like got on and saw a couple friends here and there. And a friend of mine in college would hashtag, which you know what hashtagging was, macros. And it was totally just like this floating, like weird word. No idea what it meant, but I would see it pop up around like food sometimes. Anyway, no idea what it meant. And my friend moved away to Orange County and started counting macros. So I'm like, what is this? And at the same time for me, we had planned this big trip to Italy, me and my husband. And I was having, right before our trip, it was such a big deal. I'd spent like six months planning this trip. We didn't travel a lot back then. It was such a big deal. I’m like, you know, it was like my full-time job planning this trip. And I started having these terrible like stomach issues, went to the doctor and it was like gallbladder stuff. So I didn't get my gallbladder out, but I still sometimes have these like little episodes of my gallbladder. And the doctor suggested eating a low-fat diet because that can sometimes be an issue, you know, if your gallbladder is like harder to digest fat. So that was crazy to me because, you know, that was definitely like coming. I mean, there's still a lot of truth in that, but that was coming out of a phase that was all about like healthy fats and low fat was so bad.

It was considered so bad, I thought, because low fat can be synonymous with like buying crap from the grocery store that's filled with other crap to make it low-fat, right? So that just felt like a bad word to me, like I'm going to eat like low-fat. It was like embarrassing to me to buy like a low-fat dressing at the grocery store. So anyway, it triggered this phase of life to me where I was like, okay, I think I need to figure out how to eat low-fat and still like, like my food. And then I learned about macro counting. And so anyway, a friend who was doing macro counting introduced me to you and by my little bit of research and whatever, I kind of felt like that would fit with this new issue I was having. And anyway, so that's where it started. So I hired you as a coach and like knew nothing and figured out as it went and felt so good. Like it was definitely, I mean, you know, it was for me, it was like, I'm so grateful because that's why I was able to start my business because I was so excited about it. It was so successful for me. It was so positive, like learning this new look, like this new take on food and dissecting kind of the bits and pieces and being able to build these amazing meals and feel really confident in what I was eating in a day and to continue to feel a little better with my body every single day. It was just like such a positive experience for me. And anyway, the whole, my whole business.

Amber B 05:54

Yeah. Yeah. So walk me through how that came about. So you had your own transformation, your own experience. I'm sure you learned a lot about what to eat and how to eat and how to put together recipes and how did that translate into your business? 

Lillie Biesinger 06:08

I mean, yeah, I just, again, back then Instagram was nothing. It was just like, I followed some friends and I just got so excited about my meals. Like I think, you know what it probably was too, because I started counting macros. I probably started following some macro accounts. And so it was put on my radar that people shared food, you know, like that was new. And so I think I was just so excited about these meals I was making, because to be honest, I'm going to sound like a snob, but I'm following all these macro people and I'm like, okay, yeah. Like, no, I don't want to eat that. You know, it was like all the, like, it was a lot of men. I felt like it was a lot of that, um, that hashtag IIFYM whatever, if it fits your macros, lots of like, you still see it, but lots of like protein pop tarts and protein donuts and stuff that will just never resonate with me. Like trying to take the thing that's supposed to be decadent and just pump it full of protein. And now it's macro friendly. Like maybe that works if you're a bodybuilder and you're trying to eat, you know, tons of calories a day and you just want to make sure everything has protein. But for most of us women, that's not really going to be the trick that helps you have success. 

So I was like, okay, cool.But like, I want beautiful, normal food that I was eating before, but also calculated and macro friendly, et cetera. So I was just creating these lunches in particular, because that's when I was like home and I had my kids and we'd go to the gym and come home. And I would like, be so excited about what I was going to eat. And I'd make this beautiful lunch and I just had to tell somebody about it. So I didn't want to annoy all my Instagram friends. And so like my normal friends, my real life friends. So I eventually just decided to start a separate page. And I was like, I'm not going to tell anybody about it. I just want this like a journal. I'm just so proud of my meals, you know? And then slowly it was like, I'll just like, let them to follow me. And then eventually I let it like trickle out. You know, you feel kind of like ashamed and embarrassed. Like I'm not trying to be an influence. I'm not trying to be like one of those people. I'm not trying to like make something of it. And then anyway, and then it just kind of evolved. And then there was like requests for a book, which is for me, what made, what turned it into a business. Cause I wasn't making any money until I decided to write the first cookbook. And that's what like switched gears. So it felt like, like my job and not just a hobby. I'll spend way too much time on, you know? 

Amber B 08:16

Yeah. Yeah. Uh, if I was thinking about what you were saying about how you kind of looked at like the industry and the people that were already making recipes, you know, did it one way. And if I had to like pinpoint or explain to somebody, like what I see as the difference in like your recipe creation and your style, one is like, it's beautiful. I think that is something that you do such a good job of it. It's like, it's just, it's just beautiful and aesthetic to look at. And I think it's more exciting to eat food that looks amazing. Right. And so I think you do. And then I think, I think that you do really well also is the inclusion of so many vegetables into, into your recipes. And that's something that I see. I don't see a lot of macro friendly people doing because the focus is so much on protein and what I love about your recipes is it's yes, it's, it's protein focused, but it also has so many more of those micronutrients and the fiber, which I think a lot of people forget about. And that to me is like the aesthetic, how beautiful it is and how beautiful it is to look at.

And then how many micronutrients and vegetables you're getting in your, in your meals, plus the protein, of course, like they're balanced macro, macro-friendly, but that would be the thing that I think is so unique about you. And one of the things that I think people just love about you and your content and the things that, that you produce. 

Lillie Biesinger 09:30

And that is so two fold also, because it is so important to get that fiber and those macro, those micronutrients. But even if you're one of those people that's like, I don't really care. I just want to hit my macros and get skinny. Even if you have that brain still, and you really don't think you care, like you're young and you don't think you care yet. It's also so much more. What's the word I'm looking for? It's, it's, it's gonna, that's the only way to create volume meals. And when you have a deficit, when you're trying to eat to lose fat, and you have to eat fewer calories than you want, that is the only way really to bulk up your meals and make them feel more filling. Like it doesn't matter how like macro friendly, like you're, if you made your sauce a little lower fat on your fettuccine Alfredo or whatever, if you don't bulk it up with any veggies, you're still gonna have a tiny portion for like, you know, if you're really like in a deficit, your macros are kind of low for the day. So I just feel like people really don't under, I realized when people are first starting off, they don't understand how important that is to really make your meal bigger, more satisfying, take longer to eat. Because yeah, if you have all the control in the world, and you're just like, well, I'm just gonna eat what I'm supposed to eat. And that's it. You can still have success. But for most of us, it's like, if it's, if you, if you feel like you're just dying every day and starving every day, then it's not sustainable. It's so much harder to adhere. You're just so much less likely to have success. So I feel like it's like the veggies are so crucial.

Amber B 10:58

Yeah. I mean, it makes, I mean, like you said, if you're hungry all the time, you're likely not going to stick to whatever it is that you're trying to do to create that deficit and have bigger volume. Like you said, have it take longer to eat, make you feel more full is all going to be things that are going to make you more likely to stick to the deficit, which means you're going to be more likely to get the results that you're, you're trying to attain.

Lillie Biesinger 11:21

Right. 

Amber B 11:21

Um, now, okay. So, so we go back, you started this account. You didn't really think anybody would be following you. Now you've, uh, produced what three, four cookbooks. How many cookbooks do you have now? 

Lillie Biesinger 11:34

Um, I can't, I can't believe I'm five. I can't believe I'm like a true blank for a minute with the Crunchwrap book, five books. 

Amber B 11:40

So five books, have so many followers and people who just love what it is that you do. Is this anything that you ever saw for yourself or like, how do you, how do you look back to like the Lillie in 2018 and compare and contrast it to where you are today? 

Lillie Biesinger 11:54

Yeah, no, it's crazy because it's a huge part of our life now. Like my business is a really big part of my life. My family's like Ross helps me a ton with it. It's a huge part of his life. Um, no. So it's crazy to think like, what if I'd never done it? Like what? Sometimes I'm like, what if I'd never done it? Like, could I just be one of those moms? It's like, it's to go on lunch dates and stuff, you know, like, um, and it's my own fault. I love it. And so I, I could do less for it, but there's always, you know how it is. There's just always more to do. There are like 10 businesses within an umbrella that you could do if you have time for it. So it just, it feels like this amazing opportunity. You don't want to squander and it takes up a lot of time, but, but what exactly was your question? I feel like I missed your question. 

Amber B 12:43

I just want you to look back. And if you could go back and like, talk to yourself, right. It's like you in 2018 compare and contrast with the version of you in 2025, what would you go back and say to her? What would she be amazed about now? 

Lillie Biesinger 12:56

I know, I don't know, but I, I do. One thing I think a lot is it's a good thing. I didn't know, um, like how successful it could be because I, I, that, that doesn't work with my personality. I'm, I'm really like, Oh, you're not, you probably won't like this, but this might not, this might not be for you. You know? Like, I feel like there's a lot of people on there that are like, I don't know. I feel like on Instagram, it seems like to be successful. You have to be like, I have the one trick you need. I have the one solution for you. And that's not how I am at all. I'm kind of like, it might work for you. It might not. I like it. And you probably won't, you know, like, that's how I work. So I feel like if I would have known, like how many people might buy my cookbook, I don't think I would have had the guts to do them. You know? Like I just would have felt like, no, no, no, no, no. For me, it was like this little project again, because that was the start of it being a business for me. It felt like this little project, I was just going to make this one little book and I wasn't even going to have anybody edit it. I did it all myself in the most ridiculous way you can imagine. I saved a JPEG for every page of that first book. You can't even go back and edit those pages. Like I just, I knew what I knew. I don't like to learn new things. I just like to put my head down and get like, get crap done the way I know how to do it.

So that's what I did. I was up all night, like forever. And then I just put out this book and I thought like a little bit of my audience would buy it and then it would just be done. You know, I never would have expected that it would continue to sell that first book. I'm still kind of like waiting for people to be like, there's a lot of mistakes in this one and people are forgiving and wonderful. But anyway, so I think it's good. I didn't know the potential and that's what's worked for me. Just kind of putting my head down and being like, okay, I'm just going to keep kind of like, Ross and I always say like my, our motto for my business is like to fall forward. Like it's like, I'm never ready and I have nothing that are perfect, but you just got to keep like falling forward and then you move forward. Yeah

Amber B 14:46

Like the Silicon Valley, it's like fail often, fail fast, fail forward. 

Lillie Biesinger 14:51

Totally.

Amber B 14:52

I think it's a secret to so many things in life is just 

Lillie Biesinger 14:57

Totally. Do it.

Amber B 14:58

Failure over and just do it fast and do it forward. And then so I would love to hear you speak a little bit to the tracking and how tracking has changed for you over the years, because I think a lot of people come into macro counting and there's always this question for a lot of my clients of like, do I have to track forever? Does that change? Can I let go of it? Can I go through different seasons of life? And so I would just love to hear from you, how has tracking changed over the years? And what has that looked like from periods of more intense tracking, less intense tracking, not tracking at all, or just kind of talk through your experience. 

Lillie Biesinger 15:32

Yeah. I mean, at first I recognized it's only going to be different for me because I do it for a business. So I'm, I'm calculating everything and I, and I calculate so much more than the average person because I'm creating recipes all the time. So it is super intuitive for me. I don't have to think that much about it. I don't have to think about, you know, I remember learning from you a million years ago to like measure your pot ahead of time and maybe make a note on the pot. Well, I have notes in my notes app of all my pots and I wouldn't, I could never forget, like weigh a recipe at the end or whatever, you know, like these are things that are just so natural for me now. So that makes it easier.

So in some ways I'm always tracking because it's my business. But in other ways, there are plenty of days I never open the app, but in my brain I track macros, but I eat so, I'm so happy to eat the same thing every day for my breakfast and my lunch, my snack on a normal day when I'm not traveling, it's just going to be the same foods because that's what I love. And it's a simplified life. I'm just busy and I know what feels good and what makes me feel satisfied. So there's no need. I'm never like, Oh, I forgot to track that. Is it going to fit? Like, I don't have to think like that at all. So I just kind of know. So at this point to answer your question. Yeah, I'll know about what my macro goal is. And even that is so flexible, unless I am doing something intense. And I've decided I really want to like, really have my points of data and see a new goal or whatever.

But I'm usually not doing that. I'm usually just sort of like hanging tight. If anything, I'm usually putting my efforts into making my gut feel better, or making sure my hormones are regulated at this point. So my eating kind of stays the same. So yeah, it's changed in that it feels much more like just relaxed. And I totally but for years, I've changed this mentality. I see, I'm sure you probably feel the same. I see fats and carbs as pretty like, whatever. 

Amber B 17:29

Yeah.

Lillie Biesinger 17:29

So for me, even if I think I'm tracking like religiously, unless I'm doing like I've worked with this coach for my gut, I did a little bit like keto. So then it was different than I was strict, strict. But if I'm not doing something like that, then I'm going to have like a calorie goal, I'm going to have a protein goal, I'm going to hit that protein goal so naturally, because I know what to eat the day. So it's not like I'm ever gonna be like, Oh, my gosh, it's 10 o'clock, how am I gonna have my protein? That's never happened to me. And, and then the rest of my calories are just gonna be broke up into fat and carbs, however they are. So I'm going to track my, my lunch. And if it's way higher in fat, then my dinner is just going to be like more carb and more fat. I'm sorry, not that at all. I don't really care about that. First of all, I'm just gonna say I have 600 calories left for dinner. And I'm gonna eat a dinner that's like about that and make sure I have a protein, you know, and that's not going to feel like a sloppy day. That's just going to feel like solid tracking. So, that.

Amber B 18:16

Yes. The word that you use that I want to reiterate is relaxed. 

Lillie Biesinger 18:22

Yeah.

Amber B 18:23

And that is for someone, especially who is new to tracking macros can feel like, how could I ever get to this place where it's relaxed, it feels like it's, I have to think about it a lot. And I get into the end of the day, I'm trying to hit my protein, and it can feel not very relaxed. But what I want, what I love that you just gave a picture of is when you go through that learning curve, and you get to the other side, you can get to the point where it is more intuitive, where you don't have to track every single thing, where it's a little bit more relaxed, where you're just a little bit more like intuitive about, I know how many calories are in this, or I know what how to put my day together in a way that keeps it balanced. And I think giving people a perspective of like, that's, that's the goal is to not religiously down to the gram every single day, weigh everything for the rest of your life, that would, that would not be work for most people. But it's to get to this place where macro counting teaches you about portion sizes, it teaches you about micronutrients, it teaches you about macronutrients, it teaches you about fiber, it teaches you about the composition of your food so that you can get to a place where you're a little bit more relaxed, you have the intuitive knowledge, and you can eat in a way that feels good for you. And it sounds like that's what you found. 

Lillie Biesinger 19:28

Right, right. And I really see, I see my day in blocks. And I see like, placeholders, like, you know, so for me, I'm going to eat the same thing breakfast, lunch, and I'm going to know that I that I pretty much always have five to 600 calories left for dinner. So I don't care if we on a whim decide to go out, or what I'm making for dinner. I mean, like, if you follow my meal plan, you'll know, pretty much every single recipe is going to fall under 600 calories, often under 500 calories. And that's like intentionally, you can always eat more, you can always add a hunk of bread, very easy to increase your calories in your meal, but it's a lot harder for people to really say. So it's like, it's not stressful to me at all. I know that whatever I make will fill that block very easily without sabotaging anything. And I know how to order at a restaurant to do about the same thing. So it's like, you know, none of that feels stressful to me anymore. 

Amber B 20:19

Yeah, it's awesome. So like we said, you've been doing this for a while. And unfortunately, both of us have gotten older in the process. 

Lillie Biesinger 20:27

Unfortunately.

Amber B 20:28

Both older, ages, hormones, you know, perimenopause, different seasons of life with your kids. Talk a little bit about how that's impacted your journey with food and with tracking. 

Lillie Biesinger 20:41

Yeah, I mean, I know I've shared this before, but just like, I never want to, I never want to say like, it's, it doesn't work, it stops working, because to me, it's never not going to work, it's never not going to be beneficial to pay attention to how your body feels on certain macros. And that's what macro counting is, macro count, whatever people say, macro counting doesn't work for me. I'm like, doesn't really mean anything. That's like saying, eating calories doesn't work for me. Like, like, you know, like, whatever. So bottom line is like, all that macro counting means is that you're, you're paying attention, you're taking notes, right? You're like, actually watching what you eat today. So but that doesn't mean that the same amount of somebody else eating is going to work for you or whatever. So for me, as I've gotten older, what used to work, like because of macro counting, I know exactly what I ate. I know exactly. You know, whatever, all those things in those first couple years that brought me like so much success, I know exactly how, how lean I got and how much, how much I could see like certain muscles. And that doesn't happen to me now. It certainly doesn't happen to me on those same macros. And I even like, you know, push myself harder. And, and I'm always paying attention. I'm always lifting weights, etc. You could for sure argue that I'm not pushing myself hard enough there. And that's, that's another conversation. And that's true. But I wasn't really back then either. 

Anyway, so I can see that it's changed. So I will say like, it does frustrate me. Sometimes you'll see, just like I said, there's so many experts online, of course. And I feel like you'll see a lot of kind of belittling for people who are using things as an excuse, like, no, it's not your thyroid. It's just that you're eating too much. It's because the ice cream is not your hormones. And, and I'm sure that's true sometimes, but I don't think that's really helpful. And I think that there are a lot of variables, like, just from my own experience. Now, I feel I never felt like I was not compassionate, but I feel more compassionate for people who really struggle with weight loss, because I don't think it's totally, I don't think it's linear. I don't think it's “fair”, like, I just think there are a lot of variables, especially for women, and especially as we get older. 

And I'm not an expert of listen to like my fair share podcast about premenopause. But I, I'm one of those people, like, I feel like I listen, and I'm a genius. And then if you ask me anything, I'm like, I don't remember, I can't like, repeat it. But I'm convinced that there's a lot going on in our bodies. And it's just not that simple. So, so yeah, I've just been through a lot of that where for me, it's usually gut stuff. And I feel like it's so obviously tied. If I'm having a lot of digestive distress, my weight crimes, and I when I was younger, I was like, well, it doesn't matter. It's just I don't really care if I'm bloated, I'm not gonna be somewhere body fat. But it's kind of all the same. Like if my gut is not happy, the scale goes up and everything on the body, it feels less comfortable and looks less comfortable. You know, it's very much lined up.

So anyway, I just think that's how it's changed. It's much less like a math formula. And it's just sort of, it's just sort of a never ending thing. And I've accepted that, you know, I think like, I don't know, I think there's some people who are like, think it's such a problem, if you're like, thinking about it too much, or I don't know, I just think this is life. It's like anything in our life where you're never done, you have to constantly be like, renavigating your phase of life and your marriage and your parenting skills and your faith and whatever. And it's the same with your health, you just have to keep like doing your best at your current stage. 

Amber B 24:09

It's such a good analogy to so many other areas of life. When we talk about growth, you're never done with growth in your faith, in your marriage, in your parenting. And like, it just, it just shifts and changes. I remember when my kids were little, and it was like, I figured it out. I got the nap schedule. I got it down. And then you know what, they freaking got older and the nap schedule was thrown off and I had to read it out. Right. And I feel like people some on some level almost expect their health and fitness journey to like be static, to where like what used to work will always work. And the same thing is going to always produce the same result. And I think your experience is very common of like, yes, what used to work may not work. It doesn't mean we can't figure out what will work. 

Lillie Biesinger 24:52

Right. 

Amber B 24:53

But it is going to change and you're going to have to, 

Lillie Biesinger 24:55

Right, and that might be a process. Might be a while.

Amber B 24:58

Might not be fun and it might be different. And, and there is some element of like that is life evolution. And that is what growth looks like is it's doesn't always look the same as it, as it looked in the past.

Lillie Biesinger 25:10

Right. 

Amber B 25:11

I love that perspective. What would you say to people who think macro counting is restrictive or it's stressful, or it's like, like you said, too obsessive or like makes me think about food for too much. What would you say to someone who feels that way? 

Lillie Biesinger 25:28

Yeah. I mean, I think, I think it's just kind of the age old, like choose your hard concept where, um, sure. Like, I mean, you can deaf. I mean, I get it. First of all, I get it. And I think when you're new to anything, it's overwhelming. I don't like to learn anything new. I've learned that as I've gotten older, I'm so set in my ways. Like my kids are like, how do you, my kids are like, how do you have a business online? And you like are on social media and yet you can't learn how to like plug in your air pod, you know, like these new, I'm like, don't make me Ross have, I mean, a new, something new techie. And I'm like, why did you get me this? Like, I don't want to learn anything new anyway. So I just think I get that. Like with my meal plan, that's hard for me because I know how I am. And there's a learning curve and people who people who take the time are obsessed with all the features of the meal plan. But if you don't want to take like the time to figure it out, then you're kind of like, Oh, too many, too many nuts and bolts, you know? 

So I get that macro counting. It is what it is. It is. There are details and there is like data and you're, you're calculating, like you're some mathematician. It seems like it could be over the top, but I mean, in my opinion, it's like, you can say it's restrictive or it can feel just super empowering. And I think it's empowering because bottom line is like, what is your goal? So if you care enough to be looking into macro counting, you probably want a change. You probably want to have some success in your, in your physical change and your body, how you feel or look or whatever it is. And so do you want a formula that you can kind of like stick to and, and hopefully you get there or, you know, do you just want to like feel it out and that's different for everybody? Yeah. And I totally respect that it's not for everybody. I know we're not all the same and not everything works the same, like the same things that are successful for some are not for others. And there's all those sides of people who get like really too obsessive and people who have passed with eating disorders, et cetera.

So like, that's not lost on me. And I think you got to pay attention to how it makes you feel, but I also think it's just a learning curve, like just about anything else in your life. And once you get past that, it can just be such a helpful tool that you can use or not use, you know, in phases of your life to hit your goals. So that you just don't have to flounder as much and you don't have to guess as much. So. 

Amber B 27:49

I think like, yes, like you can just guess, or you can have data and input and output and figure it out from there. I think like for people who like buy an aura ring, right. To like track their sleep or their stress or whatever. It's like the aura ring is not telling you to do anything. 

Lillie Biesinger 28:05

Totally.

Amber B 28:05

It's giving you information about what you're already doing. And then you get to, do I want to change that? Do I want to implement things to increase my sleep? But the aura ring is just providing you information. And then now you get to go do something with that. And that's really how I think about macro accounting is it's giving you information of what you're already doing. You're eating macros every single day, whether you like it or not. 

Lillie Biesinger 28:26

Yep, whether you like it or not. Yeah.

Amber B 28:28

We'll pay attention to it and now have a lot more ability to be able to make informed decisions about what you want to do. It's not forcing you to not eat the ice cream or, you know, a protein goal. Like you get to what you do with that information.

Lillie Biesinger 28:41

Right. Like bottom line is if, again, if your goal is fat loss, which if you're looking at a macro account, that's probably why you're going to have to be in a core deficit. And by nature of being in that deficit, you're probably going to feel a little bit restricted because that's kind of what it means. You're eating fewer calories than your body needs to sustain its current size. So you're probably going to feel a little hungry. You're going to feel a little restricted. So that's already happening. The macro counting is just the tool that can, in my opinion, can just help you maximize your food at that deficit so that you actually can feel much less restricted and deprived and much less hungry. It just makes you, it helps you to like put this puzzle together to make the most of it. And yeah, it's maybe a little bit more work on the front end so that you can have more success and feel better in the process, I think, you know. 

Amber B 29:32

Yeah. So we talked a little bit about, you know, adding the veggies and that's something that you do so well in your recipes to be able to make them more volume, bigger, more satisfied. Are there other tricks that you have found throughout the years to be able to, like you said, decrease that feeling of restriction, increase your satisfaction, the enjoyment of the process as you are in a caloric deficit where, like you said, you're eating less calories than your body needs? How do you make it as enjoyable as possible? 

Lillie Biesinger 29:59

Yeah. So I mean, I'll be honest, like it's not for everybody. I feel like it can annoy people. I used to get people that were like, oh my gosh, another salad. Like you don't have to order another salad. I love salad. 

Amber B 30:09

I do too. 

Lillie Biesinger 30:10

But I think it's like, I think it's kind of a learned thing because A, I love vegetables and I always have. But B, when you realize, when you love to eat and I want to, like if I'm in a restaurant, I do, I want to be eating till the bitter end. Like I do not want to be the first person down with my food because then I'm going to be like, who has french fries? Where's the bread on the table?  Where's the chips? You know, so I want my food to last. It's at home, that's at restaurants. So I've definitely learned whether I did it to myself or whether it was natural. Like I love everything over a bed of greens because I just want it to last longer. I feel like it just stretches almost any savory dish. I will have them for a bed of greens or with a bunch of greens on my plate, usually in a bowl.

So that is big for me. And then like kind of on that note, I share those, these sweet vinegars all the time by Baker and Olive. It's like a store close to me, but I know like if you have a local olive oil store, they'll sell like similar products. But that is a huge one for me because I'm doing all these beds of greens. And so like, I feel like for people who don't have salad, they're like, oh, I can't get salad unless I have tons of yummy like ranch or some caloric dressing. Well, for me, these vinegars are so good. So that's the, that's, it really is such a key for me because almost every day I'm having a big bowl of greens tossed in this vinegar and then whatever on top of it, all the foods on top of it. Even if we're making like a spaghetti squash casserole, or it's like, I still incorporate that cause it just makes my food bigger, you know, but usually we're grilling meats and that's really natural for me. 

And then a really important one is just like keeping fats low where you might not think of it. And that sounds controversial to people. Like if I just throw that in a post on Instagram, because obviously fat is not bad for you. And like, so you always got to do all the disclaimers like that. It's so good for you. It's essential. We all know that it also tastes really good, really high quality, respectable, delicious meals at a restaurant are going to have tons of fat. Like I have all the respect for fat, right? It's like my best friend, but it's the fastest way for your calories to climb and meal. So I just think I've learned, you know, you start to Amber, I'm sure you feel the same. You've known things for so long. Like there's certain things that seem really obvious. 

Amber B 32:14

Yeah.

Lillie Biesinger 32:15

You don't like think to have to explain it. And I've just learned like, that's not obvious to people. Like they'll get offended. Like why like that's so good for you. I'm not afraid of fat. People say like, I'm not afraid of that. And it's like, oh, no, I'm not. I'm not afraid of fat. I'm just aware that if I allow my meal to be full of a lot of fat, my calories are going to be exponentially higher, because there are nine grams of nine calories in a gram of fat, where there's only four calories in a gram of protein or carbs. So you can get all these calories from these two tablespoons of olive oil and feel like your meal did not change at all, right? Or you can get those same calories from a nice scoop of rice in your salad or whatever it is. So to me, that's super important. If you're trying to eat these, you're trying to survive in a deficit. First thing that should kind of go are your fats, which is why that's what you see when you work with a macro coach. And you get these numbers and you're like, how am I supposed to keep? How am I supposed to only eat 40 grams of fat a day? That's like the hardest thing I think, if you first start kind of macros.

And you and I had talked about already, not necessarily being careful about the fats and carbs, right? Like it's okay if they fall where they fall. I think that's true. But I think the reason why we usually see those low fats is because that's going to, in my opinion, give you such a better shot at success in your deficit, if you learn how to do that. Because if you just kind of strip the fats away, you can still have decent sized meals and keep to your caloric goal. 

Amber B 33:36

Yeah, that volume is so, so important. And fats are so little. 

Lillie Biesinger 33:41

They're so little. Yeah. It's a lot of flavor, but you just got creative.

Amber B 33:46

And it doesn't provide the volume that like a bed of greens for very low carbs will provide. 

Lillie Biesinger 33:54

Right.

Amber B 33:54

Talk to me a little bit about Instagram and having a large audience and having a large following. And I feel like the more eyeballs that you have, like you were saying it before, like the more you have to couch everything of like thinking about how people take it a certain way. And if they're going to misconstrue what you were meaning, how has that learning curve been for you? 

Lillie Biesinger 34:17

I mean, man, it's changed so much, right? Has it changed so much for you too? 

Amber B 34:22

Oh yeah. So much. 

Lillie Biesinger 34:23

Like in the beginning, I mean, I was so honest. I feel like the whole world has just shifted. I mean, obviously for a million reasons, it's shifted. And a lot of it is good. Like, it's good to be, you're like really careful and not want to trigger people and not want to like, you know, set anybody up to, I don't know, feel bad or make a choice that's going to be bad for them, et cetera. I don't know. But in the beginning it was like, I did not worry about anything being, I just said whatever. I don't even want to refer to it because I know it's like different now. 

Amber B 34:57

Yeah.

Lillie Biesinger 34:58

So my point is just, yeah, I have to be very careful. Like I remember I did this post kind of more recently, like a year ago or maybe it was a year and a half ago where I shared a sandwich. And my trick was, cause this is one of my tricks and diet, the people who hate diet culture, they just love to hate on this one. Yeah. Like they go hardcore on this one, like hollowing out your bread. Well, to me, I'm like, it's just, it is what it is. Like if you have issues, if it really bothers you and you feel like that triggers a eating disorder, like please don't hollow out your bread. But I'm like, cool. I can buy stupid thin bread from the store because I'm going to trust them to cut my bread thin or I can manipulate my own bread that I didn't taste better. Yeah. So to me, I don't want like this weird little like flax bagel thin or whatever. I want crufty white bread for this particular sandwich. And so I'll use a ciabatta. I do this at restaurants all the time and rip out like the inside also, cause I don't miss it at all. Right. So like, I just think you learn like where your food is a value to you. And I don't want to feel ashamed of like skipping where it's not a value.

So I would rather have like, I don't, anyway, so I'm on a tangent, but for instance, I think it's totally, there's no shame for people. If you just eat an open-faced sandwich, or if you're just this girl who just naturally you eat half your sandwich and then you walk away. Right. That's so cool. That's so intuitive. You just, you're not hungry anymore. You just walk away. Well, guess what? Like, I'm not going to do that. I'm gonna eat all the food on my plate because like, that's what I like to do because I like my food. So I have to be more strategic about what I order or what I create myself. So I shared this post about like slicing my ciabatta bread in four thin slices instead of just in half. Right. So just picture you're like ciabatta like this, kind of like a bagel and, you know, getting four thin slices out of it instead of the two. So that way I can have two sandwiches. To me, that makes perfect sense because I get to naturally get more protein in, in a ratio that I like. Right. Instead of just packing the meat in that one sandwich, I now get two sandwiches so I can like get all the turkey. I want all the veggies I want and the same amount of bread and feel like I get two sandwiches. It was just like yummier. 

And anyway, so much hate on that one. Cause it went viral. And then there's all the people that are like, why are you afraid of carbs? Yeah. And I'm like, I don't, how, how do we gather that I'm afraid of carbs? And I'm literally eating this big ciabatta roll, but you know, whatever. 

Amber B 37:20

Just two sandwiches.

Lillie Biesinger 37:21

Yeah. I just want more food, you know, but you got to be more careful.

Amber B 37:27

Yeah. Mindset that's so valuable to, and I just, I hope people are listening to this and listening to the way that you're speaking about it. Like the mindset that you're approaching this decision with is just like, this is what's valuable to me. And this was what matters to me. And so I'm going to manipulate things to be able to prioritize what matters to me versus I think what people think when they see that is they think that you're making that decision from, I can't have this, or if this carbs is bad, or I'm scared of carbs. And so it's like, they're looking at, and they're making a judgment call about how you're thinking about it, which is, which is incorrect. And if you can, that's what I love about macro counting is getting to that place where you're not making the decision because it's bad or wrong or shame filled, or you're going to be guilty if you eat it or whatever, all the judgmental pieces that we have around food, it's comes down to like a, this is what's important to me. It's important to me to have volume. It's important to me to have flavor. It's important for me to get my micronutrients in. And I'd rather have two, the same amount of carbs, but split it into two so I can have a sandwich. That's the size that I want. Right. It's how you're making the decision, not the decision that what, what is on your plate afterward that decision. And I think that's good. 

Lillie Biesinger 38:32

Right. Right. Totally. Yeah. And to answer your question for the most part, I've just like, you get a lot thicker skinned. Right. And for the most part, anybody who's kind of unkind is not a follower. It's usually if you kind of go viral, which almost never happens to me. So most part I have just nice, nice people who are following, but I'm certainly like more careful than I used to be.

Amber B 38:51

Yeah. Yeah. Oh, it's such a fun place to navigate. 

Lillie Biesinger 38:55

Yeah, it is. 

Amber B 38:56

Talk to me a little bit about your meal plan, because this has been something, how long has it been now? Maybe a year? It's been even a year?

Lillie Biesinger 39:04

Yeah, it's been like, yeah, a little over a year. It was like a year ago.

Amber B 39:07

I mean, you started with your Instagram account, then you moved to like doing cookbooks and then you moved to the meal plan. So talk to me a little bit about that evolution and how that came about and what you learned from that. 

Lillie Biesinger 39:19

Yeah. I mean, honestly, it was just like the books where there was always requests for it. And I, for the longest time, thought I would never do a meal plan because truthfully, I would not be the target audience, which is why I do what I do. Right. I'm always in the kitchen. I'm always cooking. I love to create. I love to be kind of spontaneous, whatever it is. I'm not super organized. I'm not. I have literally never followed a meal plan like ever, you know, I've never even like written out my plan for the week for my family before this, truthfully, like, I just not really how I'm just kind of I'm more of a fly by the seat of my pants, human in general, and just about everything. So, so it was a little like not intuitive for me to do it. So I feel like I put it off for a couple of years of like, you know, getting plenty of feedback from people that they would want it.

And then finally, I mean, honestly, what happened was I had this wonderful team approach me that would help me with the whole back end of it. And, and we were looking into it, actually, because about a year before when I put out the my planned cookbook, so maybe that was two years before. I can't remember now. So that was originally meant to be a meal plan. I started writing what I thought would be a meal plan. But I could not figure out the whatever the platform, the software, the app, like that was all just too overwhelming. And so I had all this stuff right now. And I kind of like start putting out feelers. And somebody that was working with me looked at it and was like, this is a book like you're writing a book, you should just turn this into a book. And so anyway, we just totally switched gears and turn that into planned, which is like a cookbook that kind of incorporates a meal plan, a six week meal plan. So that was almost like my first like dive at it, you know, and now it had really great response. And people just really love some people just really, really want to be told what to eat, not only giving good recipes, but told what to eat.So they just eliminate one more decision. 

And I totally get that there's so many areas of my life, like, you know, I said, I don't do that with meal planning. There are so many areas of my life where I'm like, do not ask me even my opinion, just tell me how to decorate that room or tell me how you're going to fix my faucet. Don't give me options. Just tell me how much I need to pay you and fix it, you know, whatever it is. So I feel like that's what this is for a lot of people. They're like, give me the recipes, but also tell me exactly how to line them up and tell me exactly what the grocery list is. So I can go buy the stuff and just have my week plan. And it's been amazing because it's a really cool platform. And yeah, the people who have figured out the little learning curve to utilize all the resources, I think it's, I think it's pretty incredible. Anyway, for, for that pool of people who just want that decision fatigue gone. And especially maybe if you are new to macros, or if you don't like all these things we've talked about, if you are kind of like, I don't want to be obsessive, I don't want to have to weigh all my food. I really feel like this can be such an amazing solution for people because it's planned the whole day. And I can guarantee you, if you eat this breakfast, lunch, and dinner, you're going to have some wiggle room for some snacks for even a little bit of like chips or a little dessert or whatever. Cause I mean, it's super low. I, a day of the plan is like 1200 calories. It's way below what most people should be eating intentionally, because again, it's so easy for you to add another portion. 

And for me, it's because I always have this 500 calorie shake at night. So I'm always going to think in terms of like saving room for your dessert and little like nibbles in between or whatever. Anyway, so I feel like it can just be really helpful for people to like have that part of their life done. Anyway, I feel like I got sidetracked. Sorry. 

Amber B 43:00

I'm going to sell it a little bit too, because I love using it. And two of the things that I love most about it, one, you do such a good job of cooking like one big meal and then reusing it in different ways. So it's like, you're doing one big protein source and then you have different recipes to be able to use that same protein source in other meals. So you're not always starting from scratch when you're cooking dinner. I love that. 

And then the second thing that I love about it is the integration with like your grocery store. So you can take like the whole week and you can send it over. Like I do Walmart orders and so I can send the whole meal over to Walmart and then I can just schedule my drop-off and like grocery shopping is done for the week. And so anyway, the features that I love most about the meal plan, you've done a fantastic job of putting it together and making it really- 

Lillie Biesinger 43:48

Thank you. Thank you. Yeah. That protein bulk thing is, you'll see that through like laced in pretty much everything I do, because that is just how I cook. And I don't know how anybody's ever done it another way. Because to me, I'm like, I would never want to start from scratch every single night. Like tonight, I'm thawing some chicken to make. Tomorrow I'm thawing, you know, like that's just too much like start to finish for me. I need that out of even like, so anyway, you'll see in my first cookbook, Lillie Eats and Tells and in planned. And then of course in the meal plan, that system is incorporated where you prep a whole bunch of meat on Sunday, your bulk prep protein, and you're going to reuse that meals. And to me, that's such a saving grace, because even if you decide not to do the tacos on Tuesday that I intend for you to make with that meat, if you race in and you're like, everybody's starving and I have nothing, then big deal. You pull out the protein and you literally like making everybody chicken quesadillas or steak quesadillas, or you're putting yours over a bed of greens, or your husband's over a bed of rice. To me, there's like these simple things you can grab really quick for your base. And as long as you've got protein, you can always make a super fast meal. And especially if you're trying to hit your macros, you can always hit your macros if you've got good lean protein prep in the fridge. It's like, it takes away all your excuses, I feel like, you know. 

Amber B 45:06

So if someone's wanting to check out the meal plan or any of your cookbooks, where would they go to do that? 

Lillie Biesinger 45:13

Everything's linked on my Instagram page, lillieeatsandtells, or my blog, my website, lillieeatsandtells.com. And you can find a link for the meal plan and everything there and the cookbook. Yeah.

Amber B 45:25

Yep. I have every single cookbook and I have the meal plan. So they're awesome. And we'll link that all up in the show notes too, as well, so that people can come and find your stuff. 

Lillie Biesinger 45:36

Awesome. 

Amber B 45:37

Awesome. This has been so fun, Lillie. Thanks for coming and sharing your story, your journey, more about your recipes, and just getting to know you a little bit more. 

Lillie Biesinger 45:44

It's so fun. Thank you for having me a second time.

Amber B 45:47

I want to leave you with something Lillie said that really stuck with me. She said, it's just sort of a never ending thing. And I've accepted that. And she was talking about health and fitness, but I think this captures something bigger about our relationship with food and with our bodies. So here's what I hope that you take away from her story. Macro tracking isn't about becoming a human calculator for the rest of your life. It's about learning enough to eventually become more intuitive, just like Lillie has. Your approach to food at 25, it doesn't have to be your approach at 35 or 45. There's always room for evolution and change, you know, and rigid tracking. Maybe that was how you started or that helped you learn. It doesn't have to be rigid forever. Right now, Lillie talked about how she's much more flexible and how she's much more relaxed in her tracking. She understands her body. She's created systems and habits that work for her in her season of life. And that ultimately is the goal. You know, the weighing, the measuring, the calculating, that's all just school. And like any good education, the point isn't to stay in school forever. It's to graduate into wisdom.

So if you're listening to this and you're still in the learning phase, that's exactly where you should be. And maybe other people who are listening to this, you're ready to trust yourself more, to focus on the bigger picture. Growth isn't linear, my friends, and neither is health. Give yourself permission to evolve, to adjust, to fail forward, like we talked about in the episode, into whatever season you're in right now. You're not wrong if it looks different than it used to be. You're doing it right for where you are today. And if you want to check out Lillie's cookbooks or her meal plan, head to the show notes for this episode, because we've linked that all up for you. 

And if you want to dive deeper into this kind of approach, one that teaches you the skills so that you can eventually trust yourself, MACROS 101 is the perfect place for you. Head to bicepsafterbabies.com/waitlist to get on the interest list for when we open doors to that program. Thanks for spending your time with me today. That wraps up this episode of Biceps After Babies Radio. I'm Amber. Now go out and be strong because remember my friend, you can do anything.

Outro

If you've ever wondered what it actually looks like for me to coach you through your weight loss journey, here's your answer. Some of my most powerful podcast episodes aren't interviews or my solo rants. They're real raw coaching calls straight from inside MACROS 101. You'll hear women just like you working through plateaus, perfectionism, and the I'm doing everything but nothing's working spiral. These live coaching shows show you exactly what it sounds like to break through the mental junk that's been keeping you stuck.

So if you're even a little bit curious about what it would be like to be coached by me, or if you're thinking about joining MACROS 101, these episodes are a must listen. So here's your next move. Scroll back through the podcast feed and look for titles that end in Live Coaching Session. Start there. You'll walk away with more clarity, more strategy, and maybe even that one mindset shift you didn't even know that you needed. All right, I'll see you in the next episode.